The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

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mister_coffee
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by mister_coffee »

mister_coffee wrote: Mon Sep 11, 2023 6:34 am
dorankj wrote: Sun Sep 10, 2023 8:26 am ... You understand that there may only be 1 or 2 voices similar to mine here, but my POV represents nearly (or more than) half of American citizens?
Please rigorously define "nearly".

Let's be generous and assume that Republicans and Democrats split the population 50/50. That's consistent with the past two elections being relatively close.

Polls consistently find that about two thirds of Republicans buy into MAGA Cult mythology (e.g. "Widespread voter fraud threw the 2020 election to Joe Biden"). So if you Do The Math you would find that your POV is held by, at best, 33 percent of Americans. In no imaginable universe is 33 percent "nearly (or more than) half".

You are now reduced to arguing that "polls are fake". The next thing you guys will do is asserting that the sky is not blue.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by mister_coffee »

dorankj wrote: Sun Sep 10, 2023 8:26 am ... You understand that there may only be 1 or 2 voices similar to mine here, but my POV represents nearly (or more than) half of American citizens?
Please rigorously define "nearly".

Let's be generous and assume that Republicans and Democrats split the population 50/50. That's consistent with the past two elections being relatively close.

Polls consistently find that about two thirds of Republicans buy into MAGA Cult mythology (e.g. "Widespread voter fraud threw the 2020 election to Joe Biden"). So if you Do The Math you would find that your POV is held by, at best, 33 percent of Americans. In no imaginable universe is 33 percent "nearly (or more than) half".

You are now reduced to arguing that "polls are fake". The next thing you guys will do is be asserting that the sky is not blue.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by just-jim »

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dorankj wrote: Sun Sep 10, 2023 8:26 am …….You understand that there may only be 1 or 2 voices similar to mine here, but my POV represents nearly (or more than) half of American citizens?
And there is the crux of the problem.

You believe that 1/2 of the country does share such undemocratic, fascist and racist/sexist views, even when they really don’t. And that erroneous belief leads to the idea that it is OK to subvert an election or disenfranchise voters.

IT is NOT. And that is why Guilty Depends donnie and his willingly complicit bunch of criminal cohorts are going to pay, and pay dearly.

Standby and watch. Justice is coming.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by mister_coffee »

Rideback wrote: Sun Sep 10, 2023 4:02 pm Hold on Ken. What posts have I made that fall into the category of vile, disgusting or vitriolic?
... and here I was, hoping that my posts were vile, disgusting, and vitriolic enough ...
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by Rideback »

Hold on Ken. What posts have I made that fall into the category of vile, disgusting or vitriolic?
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by pasayten »

Ken…. You say you and others had their posts “changed”???

How many and what exactly was changed in these posts???

You have 693 posts…. How many of yours were changed?

And of course your buddy trump and his friends never harass anybody….
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by dorankj »

Funny, I’m pretty sure that’s what I’m doing! Why do you and others here think it’s required to only have one acceptable point of view? Why do you allow vile disgusting and vitriolic speech from Jim, Rideback and yourself with no censorship or condemnation but I and others have posts changed and are harassed freely? You understand that there may only be 1 or 2 voices similar to mine here, but my POV represents nearly (or more than) half of American citizens?
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by pasayten »

dorankj wrote: Sat Sep 09, 2023 9:39 am Such a self own, mr. psychology! Haha
IMG_8348.jpeg
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by Rideback »

pdf of actual lawsuit filed in Colorado based on the 14th Amendment. It gives detailed background of why the SoS should implement it.

https://www.citizensforethics.org/wp-co ... n-E5aWIJjk
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by dorankj »

Such a self own, mr. psychology! Haha
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by pasayten »

Some folks seem to revel in the attention they get from expressing their simpleminded opinions...
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by dorankj »

‘You always get the the most flak when you’re closest over the target!’
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by just-jim »

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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by PAL »

I also notice Hunter Biden does not flap his yap and threaten jurors, or election officials.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by pasayten »

Ken is still addicted to the trump kool aid...
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by mister_coffee »

... because part of being part of a cult is that you can never, ever, admit that the Dear Leader is wrong.

There is a recurring problem in this country with family members of prominent families using their family name to profit for very little effort. This is not a Democratic or Republican problem. It is a systemic social problem we have at a lot of levels in our society, and the effects are somewhere between mildly annoying and corrosively poisonous.

Outside of politics it also happens a lot with the entertainment industry. In my personal experience it also leaches over into both not-for-profit board memberships and having worthless nephews and nieces of prominent investors being given positions of power and authority in businesses far outside of their reasonable experience.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by Rideback »

Actually, no Hillary didn't go on and on about how she won, that's been repeated over and over again by the right wing media but doesn't mean it's true nor does it bring her into a class with Trump's railings.

Stacy Abrams, yes she's from GA and she's done nothing illegal. Instead she has fought and encouraged voters of GA to vote.

And there you go again with the BIden family. Time to put up or shut up. Just repeating rumors doesn't cut it in a court of law and until the Bidens face actual charges, LIKE TRUMP DOES, doesn't move the conversation. btw, sounds like David Weiss plans on charging Hunter B with the weapons charge. Except for the fact that it's a waste of the DoJ's budget to overcharge where the majority of people under the same circumstances are given a slap on the wrist, plus the fact that David Weiss signed off on the agreement not to charge, I'll just wish him good luck. Weiss hasn't filed any other charges though he's spoken out of turn to tell the media he plans on filing something by the end of Sept.

If Biden's had done what Trump and his accomplices have done I'd be cheering the DoJ on for every single indictment that was filed. Question is, why aren't you ready to read the writing on the wall for Trump and move on to another better candidate?
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

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She then went on and on saying she won (more votes, denying our legal system) he (DT) was illegitimate and she was ‘wronged’ by not being president! How about Stacy Abrams from where?……..Georgia. Then you have the whole Biden family corrupt foreign influence with actual millions of dollars to even grandkids. What were they paying for? So yes, the rule of law should matter, equally to all.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by Rideback »

Historian weighs in

https://america.substack.com/p/as-the-v ... ue&r=2be3h

In a sane world, we wouldn’t be dealing with an ex-president facing 91 felony charges and four indictments. In a sane world, that criminal defendant would not still be mouthing off and inciting violence with increasing intensity. In a sane world, there would be no question such an individual does not belong anywhere near the levers of power ever again.

But here we are, looking down the barrel of rising political violence, urged on a daily basis by Donald J. Trump and supported by tens of millions of aggrieved Republicans, persuaded that the 2020 presidential election was stolen. Never mind 60-plus court cases confirming no evidence of fraud. Never mind the visual evidence from Jan. 6, 2021, making clear what this lie can yield. Never mind the sentencing of the Proud Boys’ former leader Enrique Tarrio on Wednesday—22 years, the longest penalty to date—that may help stem large-scale, violent protests, but won’t stop more stochastic terrorism.

As the vise tightens—as the indictments in four different jurisdictions accelerate toward trials, the legal pressures mount and co-defendants begin flipping to avoid prison—we can further expect that the mob boss will continue to threaten judges, prosecutors, co-defendants and other witnesses. We can already see how this creates a climate of fear for prospective jurors.

Just this week, he told broadcaster Glenn Beck he would have “no choice” but to lock up political opponents “because they’re doing it to us.” This followed his comments in March when he swore to a Conservative Political Action Conference crowd that 2024 will be the “final battle” for America and “for those who feel wronged and betrayed: I am your retribution.” Using his insidious practice of asking a question to make clear his answer, there was this post about how he would exploit a second to indict and jail opponents: “Am I allowed to do such a horrible and unconstitutional thing if, and when, I win the Presidency? We are entering really dangerous territory.”

Of course, there was the usual, yet increasingly fevered mania this week directed at Special Counsel Jack Smith—in which Trump called the prosecutor “deranged” with “unchecked and insane aggression.” Previously, he decried U.S. District Judge Tanya Chutkan as “very biased and unfair,” adding in a post, “She obviously wants me behind bars.” All this despite the judge’s explicit warnings last month that the criminal defendant’s right of free speech is “not absolute” and that she would maintain “normal order.”

This escalation has motivated Smith and his team to file a motion Tuesday opposing Trump’s lawyers’ efforts to slow down the case by providing them two weeks to respond to the unsealing of any sensitive materials. “Such a requirement would grind litigation in this case to a halt,” they wrote, “which is particularly infeasible given the pressing matters before the Court—including the defendant's daily extrajudicial statements that threaten to prejudice the jury pool in this case.”

Yet, so far, despite Chutkan’s insistence that she would treat Trump like any other criminal defendant, we have no expedited trial date or gag order, and the defendant has not been taken into custody. Is there any doubt that this continued reluctance only intensifies Trump’s belief that the law does not apply to him and that he can continue to say whatever he wants, particularly rhetoric that incites violence? Is there any doubt, in lieu of a more serious judicial response, his behavior will become increasingly chaotic and extreme?

Add to the violent mix enablers like Mike Huckabee, the former Arkansas governor, Baptist minister and “Christian” broadcaster. On Wednesday, he said on his TBN show that if Trump loses in 2024 because of his legal battles, it would be the last election “decided by ballots rather than bullets.” Do we really need more examples of how far the Republicans have fallen in their determination to back their cult leader?

Any normal human would struggle to get out of bed on a day like Trump had on Wednesday. In the Mar-a-Lago documents case, one indicted witness who allegedly knows Trump sought to delete security camera footage made a deal to cooperate; Trump attorney Evan Corcoran’s voice memos make clear that his client knowingly hid documents in his Florida club. Trump’s attempt to delay the $250 million Oct. 2 fraud trial involving the Trump Organization was denied. And in the writer E. Jean Carroll’s second case, concerning her accusations of rape, Judge Lewis Kaplan held Trump liable again for defaming her—deciding that the January trial will only focus on how much Carroll is owed.

We are dealing with a man who has convinced himself that not only does winning the presidency provide him immunity, so does the act of running. He has convinced himself and conned his followers into believing the application of law is political persecution; at the same time, his successful fundraising off his mugshot and his focus on “unfair” prosecutions has too many Democrats worried about praising the indictments.

But here’s the thing. As I noted in March, Trump enablers and other chaos agents were banking on fear and outrage to strengthen their hand and scare Democrats over the political risks of holding candidate Trump accountable:

Either there’s rule of law or there’s not. Either we are defined by a system of justice that holds the guilty accountable or we aren’t. Either we have a democracy that limits the use of violence to define our public life and the rights of our citizens or we have a country devolving into authoritarianism in which a strongman leader can employ fear and intimidation to get and keep power.

A speedy trial is coming next month in Georgia for lawyers Kenneth Chesebro and Sidney Powell, two of Trump’s 18 co-defendants. Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis insisted this week that she wants to try all the other defendants at the same time, noting that every trial would require testimony from some 150 witnesses and take four months.

Since this trial and any that follow will be televised, we can be sure that the RICO ringleader will be unable and unwilling to keep his mouth shut. Just like Judge Chutkan, there are signs that DA Willis is not about to ignore this, especially as the Russians have already employed their cyber skills to put her, members of her staff and 23 grand jurors in increasing danger by posting their private information online (aka “doxing”). On Wednesday, she asked Judge Scott McAfee to “restrict the dissemination of jurors’ identities by any Defendant, members of the press, or any other person during the pendency of this trial.”

In a sane world, neither the Russians nor a criminally charged ex-president of the United States would be in a position to endanger the lives of Americans performing this most fundamental task of citizenship. But, so far, no one has been willing to employ the power of the judicial system to stem the violent incitements and the danger they are to the process of justice and democracy.

That must change. Either there’s rule of law or there isn’t.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by Rideback »

Ken, Hillary conceded the race to Trump, that's how she did it.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by dorankj »

How did Hillary do it? Only one side is allowed to question elections?
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by mister_coffee »

You couldn't elect a 3-year-old president either. Even if a majority wanted to.

If you don't like it the law, we have a democratic system here and you can organize and vote to change it. I want to read your reasoning on how people who conspire to overthrow our government should hold office in our government.
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by dorankj »

Can’t let those dirty unwashed “cousin-f**kers” deciding ‘democratically’ who should be POTUS. Let’s blow up our system by weaponizing the legal standards! (Funny- that’s exactly what they accused DT of trying to do)
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Re: The 14th Amendment and guilty donnie

Post by Rideback »

The cases will need to work their way through the lower courts, which is a long timeline before they land with SCOTUS.
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